Internet Marketing Coach
The Death of ClickBank
January 29th, 2008 | 22 commentsI haven’t heard “The DEATH of “insert technique/service” for a while, so why not start one of my own 
I realize this post will be somewhat controversial with other product owners who sell through ClickBank, as they don’t want people to know about ClickBanks horrible way of doing business, but it has to be said.
ClickBank has 2 HUGE problems, which I’ll get to in a minute, and this is coming from someone who earned 5 figures in the last 6 months selling a few products in their marketplace, so I’m very familiar with it all.
First, I don’t mean to be the guy who “bites the hand that feeds him.” ClickBank doesn’t feed my family, I DO! I do realize this is somewhat hypocritacle as well, as I’m still going through ClickBank for many of my products, but that will soon change and this really needs to be said.
ClickBanks 2 MAJOR Problems that will eventually Ruin Them
1: They allow customers to purchase products through their own “hop link.” When I say “allow” I don’t mean you can get away with it, I mean they SAY you CAN do it in their TOS! That’s not too big of a deal to me as a publisher, but what about my affiliates who are literally getting ripped off? It’s dumb for me to say this, but I’m going to anyway. If you promote my product or any other product in CB’s market place , 90% of the people you refer are just going to clear their cookies and order through their own hoplink, STEALING the sale from you!
2: They process refunds for any reason whatsoever without going through the publisher. It’s a good thing to offer refunds. I have no problem processing refunds. BUT when the process is so extremely easy it invites refunds. Look, you can go to ClickBank right now, order any product you want, wait for the receipt to come, forward back to them requesting a refund and you just got that electronic product for absolutely free!!
I know #2 is something that I shouldn’t be spreading all over the net, but it’s Bulls*** and hopefully instead of inviting more freebie seekers to the marketplace I persuade a few people to get away from ClickBank!
You may think that it’s not that big of a deal because most people are honest and don’t take advantage of the system. YEAH, RIGHT!! Let me give you an example. I’ve offered discounts to my article marketing report through PayPal and other services, which overall equals just about the same number of sales I’ve made through CB. The difference? The refund rate on CB is 10% (pathetic) The refund rate of all others UNDER 1%!!
Many of the refund requests I get are made within minutes of purchase. In other words, they don’t even open the damn file before they request a refund. They know they can get if for free so they do.
It really is a flawed system. Affiliates who work their butts off are being ripped off everyday and product creators like myself are losing money at the same time.
Jonathan Leger recently turned me on to PayDotCom (created by Mike Filsaime) and it’s actually a very good alternative to CB.
As product creators and affiliates we need to get away from ClickBank and their horrible business model. If you’re a product owner and/or an affiliate do yourself a favor and help build PayDotCom instead of supporting CB and it’s horrible policies.
I am an affiliate of PayDotCom, but to avoid giving the impression I’m just trying to make a few bucks I haven’t inserted any affiliate links in this post!
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30th January, 2008 at 1:08 am
I definitely agree with the refund thing. I realize that it’s very important to offer refunds on e-books, especially given the fact that there’s a HUGE difference in quality with some books. I do think that they should make it significantly more difficult to get that refund, though. Maybe a wait and some kind of form that you have to fill out, perhaps. At the very least, they should be tracking repeat offenders. I know of one forum where they specifically encourage people to get ebooks, get refunds, and then post them for other members to download at no charge. Whether you agree with e-books a a concept is irrelevant. That’s just theft.
30th January, 2008 at 2:37 am
[...] Josh Spaulding writes a post of The Death of ClickBank in his Internet Marketing blog. In his opinions, there are 2 major problem with Clickbank which [...]
30th January, 2008 at 2:54 am
Hi Josh,
I guess when you put it like that it does sound pretty s****y
My guess is that a lot of people who are savvy will indeed buy through their own link and this has bothered me, as an affiliate, for a long time.
It probably doesn’t happen so much if the product in question is not IM related, but, let’s face it, most of their digital products are.
I’ve never made a lot of money with CB and I don’t see that changing much in the future. As for sellers, I’ve always seen refund policies on non physical products as a bit of a joke. After all, 30 seconds to download an e-book and the customer has it for keeps - he can’t return it and if anyone truly believes a buyer will delete all traces of the product from their hard drive as soon as they get their money back bwahahahahahaha!
I guess there’s no easy answer - if you buy a duff e-book that fails to deliver anything it promises, well, maybe you should have done your due diligence before parting with your money.
On another note, sellers seem to find all sorts of ways to sabotage themselves - using static download pages that have long since been posted on forums and social bookmarking sites for everyone to share….don’t they ever look at their server stats and wonder why they only got one PayPal payment for five hundred downloads?
Anyway, I’m rambling as usual but IM sucks sometimes and your CB objections are just another reason why.
I did notice that your AMD was being offered on a torrent site a while back and wondered if you knew anything about it. I’m guessing you probably didn’t and I’m sure the uploader is a thief. No, I didn’t download the torrent
This happens a lot though and often, after downloading the file the freeloader is presented with instructions on how to open a password protected file - usually involving the purchase of something the thief is offering, or maybe just to fill in their details on an opt-in form. Using other people’s products illegally to build a mailing list in other words, or to entice them to buy by offering your product as an incentive. Sorry…going waay off topic, best I leave some room for other comments eh?
30th January, 2008 at 3:53 am
I’ve purchased a few ebooks off ClickBank and I’d have to say the quality was generally quite poor . . . as a matter of fact, the majority of ebooks I’ve read were poor; rehashes of content everybody else is releasing. In comparison to an in-print book, there is usually nowhere near the bang for the buck either. I wouldn’t mind if the information truly was timely, and have happily paid $20-$50 for short reports because they had original information I could put to use right away. But those are the exception and not the rule. I just think the whole ebook idea is flawed anyway (as I’ve said on my own blog . . . a recent “Death of . . . ” article
. . . ).
A few years ago ClickBank was a respectable distribution center, but those days are gone. I hope PayDotCom does better for you.
30th January, 2008 at 10:58 am
I have only ever written one ebook, and I sold it thru Clickbank, and only had one return. I didn’t sell a ton, but it was a niche book anyway. I was pleased with how it worked out at the time. On the advice of Joel Comm, I turned it into a site instead and put AdSense on it. I’m not sure whether or not that was a good move. It was probably a wash either way…since there were hardly big bucks involved.
That being said, it’s been a few years back, and over time, I’ve grown to find ClickBank a pretty distateful place to be as a consumer as well. I’d agree with your criticisms, and actually, CB reminds me of the major record labels who were so “fat and sassy” that they just decided to ignore the internet until about 3 years ago. And now, because of their inflexibility and the fact that “they just don’t get it” (not to mention the morally-indefensible pirate culture), the internet will be the death of the major labels. Maybe the same is true for CB. Certainly that will be the case if they don’t improve their business model significantly.
I’ve definitely been glad that their refund policy existed, though. After getting stung on The Rich Jerk and a couple other products that, for me, turned out to be empty shells…I was glad to see my money back.
30th January, 2008 at 3:39 pm
@ Ginger - You’re right. Refunds are very important. CB just makes it TOO easy. When you can get a refund with the click of a button it’s just ridiculous. I believe the refund should be approved by the publisher. I approve 99% of all refunds and those who don’t will be shooting themselves in the foot. CB is actually losing money by making refunds so incredibly easy because more and more affiliates are going through other services to find products to promote so they don’t lose their commissions.
@ Maurice - If someone finds the sales page organically (not through an affiliate) I don’t blame them for buying through their own link. I mean it is allowed so why not. BUT when someone recommends it to you then you clear your cookies and purchase through your own link it’s just wrong and that’s where the problem lies. Thanks for letting me know about that torrent site. I believe it’s gone now, but I’m sure it will be back up soon.
@ Terry - I mostly agree
There is ALOT of rehashed material out there. Whether it’s paid or free people see $$ and start rehashing crap. The good this is that people notice it and the trash usually never gets a whole lot of exposure, while the good stuff gets seen. I do still see value in ebooks, but I don’t think we should be buying ebooks on every subject known to man like so many people seem to do. Alot of the info can be found freely on the WWW
@ Chuck - Non-IM products tend to do alot better with CB because those who are not in the IM crowd don’t know of CB’s loop-holes. I do have to admit that CB has brought in alot of cash for me, but the fact is my affiliates are treated unfairly because I guarantee every one of them have had commissions stolen because of their hoplink system and refund policy. If honesty was something that we all possessed their refund policy would be perfect. Unfortunately not everyone is honest like you and I.
1st February, 2008 at 3:25 am
Josh,
When are you going to start offering your AMD affiliate program through PayDotCom ?
Thanks,
Todd
1st February, 2008 at 3:54 pm
Hey Todd,
Very soon
Once I do you’ll see the change on the affiliates page at:
http://www.articlemarketingdomination.com/affiliates.php
10th February, 2008 at 4:02 pm
All those that keep complaining about CB probably don’t make any real money with CB. Tell those top vendors in CB to leave CB and they will just laugh at you.
CB’s power is in the marketplace and the amount of affiliates. Refunds is just part of the game. Selling through CB marketplace and leverage off the hungry affiliates will make you much more money than any other marketplace even with the high refund rate. I rather they go contact CB directly for a refund and wasting my time asking me for a refund.
CB is the most automated system when it comes to paying your affiliates. No need to manually download some stupid list of affiliate emails and send money to their paypal. If you are not using CB, you will often get emails like “When will I get my commission”, freaking sick i must say.
10th February, 2008 at 6:06 pm
[...] The Death of Clickbank - I’ve not had much success with ClickBank yet and maybe that’s just as well because Josh Spaulding seems to think that their model is seriously flawed for affiliate marketers. [...]
10th February, 2008 at 10:26 pm
@ Jeff - I’ve made 5 figures in the past 6 months and that’s not my main business model and I’m complaining. I’m not sure what makes you think those who complain about CB’s poor structure aren’t making any money with them. I’m complaining because it is flawed. Why support such a flawed system? They do have loads of affiliates, but more and more big affiliates are promoting products from PDC and other places because they know half their commissions will be stolen at CB. How hard is it to download a mass pay file and make a payment? Seriously?
11th February, 2008 at 12:51 am
Thanks.
I hope to sell affiliate products from my site someday soon.
It will be slow because I’m not in the blogging about blogging (IM) niche, and because to have any integrity I need to check the product myself.
I was thinking about Clickbank and didn’t like the look of them much. All this is good to know (I still don’t know the ins and outs of the whole affiliate thing).
I’ll checkout paydotcom.
Thanks for honest and useful information.
14th February, 2008 at 12:24 am
I’ve yet to try out ClickBank I tend to stay within the smaller networks. I enjoy MaxBounty and PepperJam Network. I also joined RocketProfit recently and I’m putting together a campaign for that right now.
I feel strongly with you on Click bank being flawed and its like many other networks out there.
Anyways awesome blog
-Scott
13th March, 2008 at 2:29 pm
Hi Josh,
I totally agree with you in fact, Im fairly tempted to write a post on my blog also about the exact same thing. The refund rate is going through the roof at the moment…
We just did a mail out for a $190 product, I sold well over 100 copies and already have had about 10 refunds in the past week.
I made nearly $10,000 this period on Clickbank but I know that a lot of that money is going to go back to the customer.
Its pretty frustrating and in the niche I am in, Clickbank has most of the products.
Thanks for the great post anyway.
Ryan
13th March, 2008 at 6:18 pm
[...] Thankfully there are several sites out there that handle the affiliate stuff for me so it’s not something I have to worry about. I’ll probably use PayDotCom as I use them successfully as an affiliate and my friend Josh has recently warned about the problems with the ClickBank business model. [...]
27th March, 2008 at 7:14 pm
I agree about the problem with people using their own hop link, but I think this mainly a problem for affiliates promoting products to Internet marketers and the like. These people are Web savy and know about affiliate links The average Joes looking for computer software, or how to improve their golf swing are not nearly as likely to change the hop link, so I think it depends on the type of products you are promoting.
The refund policy is another issue. Clickbank’s policy does invite refunds and it’s not too difficult for people to figure out they can get the product for free. I would be interested in how big a problem this is with you “gurus”. I’ve only made a few dozen sales and never got a refund.
I’m definitely going to sign up for paydotcom.
27th March, 2008 at 9:00 pm
@ Michael - You’re absolutely right. In my experience non-IM related products do much better with refunds and commission theft than those that target other IMers and it’s obvious why.
I’ve promoted many, many, many products via CB, some my own and some created by others. The refund rate is ALWAYS extremely high on those IM related products compared to non-IM products where the refund rate is extremely low.
5th May, 2008 at 2:28 am
Josh, you may be right about CB, but recently I made 2 sales promoting products on paydotcom - the first I had to contact the publisher, he had no idea how to process a sale made through PDC, but eventually did pay me. The second just flat out stiffed me, and PDC was powerless to help me. Maybe these 2 publishers are not representative of the quality of PDC, but no thanks to PDC for me as an affiliate!
5th May, 2008 at 2:42 am
Hi Kris,
I’ve been paid all commissions so far, but I’ve heard other similar experiences, so that’s definitely a flaw with PDC.
I found it’s always best to contact the publisher ahead of time for promotions. If it’s just a sale here and then it’s probably more of an issue there.
There are pros and cons with both PDC and CB. Overall I believe CB is best for publishers and PDC is best for affiliates.
5th May, 2008 at 2:45 am
Josh, that’s what PDC told me to do, contact the publisher first. On the one hand, makes sense to start a real relationship. On the other, wish I could just sell and get paid.
5th May, 2008 at 2:48 am
@ Kris - I hear ya. Bad situation indeed. Hopefully they improve that in some way!
8th May, 2008 at 7:35 am
The refund thing IS annoying but Clickbank will be the industry standard for a long time to come (in my opinion anyway). Alot of people make ALOT of money with Clickbank and the products there are much better than those at PDC. I’ve promoted products from both as an affiliate, and I’ve always done alot better with Clickbank.
Dan